Diabetes, High Blood Pressure, and Stroke: Deven Matthews’ Road to Recovery

Recovery After Stroke

Understanding the Link Between Diabetes and Stroke

Introduction

Diabetes significantly increases the risk of stroke. This article aims to provide comprehensive information on the relationship between diabetes and stroke, including symptoms, causes, prevention strategies, and treatment options.

What is a Stroke?

A stroke occurs when the blood supply to part of the brain is interrupted or reduced, preventing brain tissue from getting oxygen and nutrients. This can lead to brain damage and long-term disability or death.

How Diabetes Increases Stroke Risk

Mechanism of Increased Risk

Diabetes impairs the body’s ability to produce or use insulin effectively, leading to high blood glucose levels. Over time, elevated glucose levels can damage blood vessels, including those in the brain. This increases the likelihood of a stroke.

Contributing Factors

• High Blood Pressure: Common in diabetics, high blood pressure damages blood vessels.
• High Cholesterol: Excess cholesterol can form plaques in blood vessels, narrowing them and restricting blood flow.
• Obesity: Often associated with diabetes, obesity further increases stroke risk.

Symptoms of Diabetes-Related Stroke

The symptoms of a stroke in people with diabetes are similar to those in the general population:

• Sudden numbness or weakness, especially on one side of the body
• Confusion, trouble speaking, or understanding speech
• Difficulty seeing in one or both eyes
• Trouble walking, dizziness, or loss of balance and coordination
• Severe headache with no known cause

Diagnosing Stroke in Diabetics

Healthcare providers use various methods to diagnose stroke:

• Physical Exam: Assessing muscle strength, coordination, and cognitive function.
• Imaging Tests: CT scans and MRIs to visualize brain activity.
• Blood Tests: To check glucose levels and other potential risk factors.
• Electrocardiogram (ECG): To identify heart issues that may contribute to stroke risk.

Treatment Options

Immediate Treatment

• Clot-Busting Drugs: Administered to dissolve clots and restore blood flow.
• Mechanical Thrombectomy: Surgical removal of large clots from brain arteries.

Long-Term Management

• Blood Thinners: To prevent new clots from forming.
• Blood Pressure Medications: To manage hypertension.
• Statins: To lower cholesterol levels.

Prevention Strategies

People with diabetes can reduce their stroke risk through lifestyle changes and medical management:

• Monitor Blood Sugar Levels: Keep glucose within the target range.
• Control Blood Pressure: Regular monitoring and medication adherence.
• Healthy Diet: Focus on low-fat, high-fiber foods, and limit salt intake.
• Regular Exercise: Aim for at least 150 minutes of moderate aerobic activity weekly.
• Weight Management: Achieve and maintain a healthy weight.
• Quit Smoking: Smoking cessation is crucial for reducing stroke risk.
• Regular Check-Ups: Frequent consultations with healthcare providers to manage risk factors.

Conclusion

Understanding the connection between diabetes and stroke is essential for effective prevention and treatment. By managing blood glucose, blood pressure, and cholesterol, and maintaining a healthy lifestyle, individuals with diabetes can significantly reduce their risk of stroke.

By incorporating these strategies, those with diabetes can take proactive steps to mitigate their stroke risk and improve overall health outcomes.

Interview With Deven Matthews

Deven Matthews experienced a stroke due to undiagnosed diabetes and high blood pressure, leading to a journey of recovery and health transformation.

Highlights:

01:54 Introduction
03:02 Diabetes And Stroke Recovery
08:02 Symptoms Of A Stroke And Seeking Medical Attention
17:46 Reversing Type 2 Diabetes Through Diet And Exercise
23:07 Coping With Stroke’s Emotional And Mental Challenges
28:10 Returning To Work After A Stroke
35:27 Sustainable Busy-ness After Stroke Recovery
43:58 Disability And Faith
50:02 Feeding The “Recovery Tiger” vs. The “Self-Pity Tiger”
1:02:08 Medical Interventions, And Hope For Improvement
1:03:12 The Hardest Thing About Stroke
1:06:44 FDA-Approved Neurostimulation Device For Stroke Recovery
1:09:59 Lessons From The Stroke

Transcript:

Bill Gasiamis 0:00
This episode of the podcast is brought to you by headbed.com.au. Hey everyone, before we dive into today’s episode, I wanted to share something special. In episode 305 I interviewed Catherine Randabel, the inventor of HeadBed a product revolutionizing hair salons, especially for stroke survivors.

Bill Gasiamis 0:20
The HeadBed provides excellent neck and head support during hair washes, reducing strain, and promoting better blood flow. For stroke survivors. This means lowering the risk of arterial damage and easing the concerns about another stroke. It ensures a safe, enjoyable salon experience.

Bill Gasiamis 0:40
I’m thrilled to support a product that aligns with my mission of stroke prevention and safety. In our interview, Catherine explained how HeadBed’s ergonomic design prevents neck hyperextension, a common issue increasing stroke risk. With the HeadBed you can feel confident and comfortable at the salon knowing your health is prioritized. If you’re a stroke survivor or know someone who is the head bed is a must-have for your next salon visit.

Bill Gasiamis 1:11
Check out episode 305 for my full interview with Catherine and learn how this product can make a difference. For those in the United States. Visit headbedusa.comheadbedusa.com to get yours today and enjoy peace of mind at the salon. Now I’d also like to mention my book The Unexpected Way That A Stroke Became The Best Thing That Happened. 10 tools for recovery and personal transformation. It fetches inspiring stories from 10 stroke survivors and offers hope for those on the road to recovery. For more information visit recoveryafterstroke.com/book or search my name Bill Gasiamis on Amazon.

Introduction – Deven Matthews

Bill Gasiamis 1:54
Well, hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of the recovery after stroke podcast. This is episode 310. And my guest today is Deven Matthews. Deven’s story is a powerful reminder of the importance of prioritizing our health. Deven was living with undiagnosed high blood pressure and diabetes, which resulted in a sudden stroke that changed his life.

Bill Gasiamis 2:17
In this compelling episode, Deven shares his journey of resilience and recovery, detailing the symptoms that led to his stroke, the challenges he faced during his treatment and the incredible steps he took to reverse his type two diabetes without medical intervention. We also discussed the emotional and mental struggles post-stroke, the significance of community support and the importance of maintaining a balanced between work and personal life. Deven Matthews, welecome to the podcast.

Deven Matthews 2:51
Hi Bill it’s really a pleasure to meet you. Thank you for having me.

Bill Gasiamis 2:56
It’s my pleasure. Also, thank you for being here. Tell me a little bit about what happened to you.

Diabetes And Stroke Recovery Journey

Deven Matthews 3:02
Well, two years ago, February, I had an ischemic stroke. It was like It landed on the left side of my brain. So my right side is affected. And it was a scare, stroke is something I never would have even anticipated happening. Like many people have strokes as a total surprise. I had undiagnosed high blood pressure and undiagnosed diabetes. So a horrible combination. And I woke up one morning and sure enough it was happening. And just like most of your listeners and the other people I heard on these podcasts. It’s alarming, it’s startling, it’s frightening. And it’s a life-changing event.

Bill Gasiamis 3:52
Deven, pardon my ignorance. How did you not know you had both high blood pressure and diabetes? How do you go about life not experiencing any negative impacts of those conditions? I don’t get it.

Deven Matthews 4:14
Good question. A lot of it was turning a blind eye I will admit a lot of it was I was extremely busy working a lot and I didn’t have time to be sick or take care of myself. So it kind of just went undiagnosed so my advice now is go see your doctor at least three times four times a year and don’t be afraid of what they’re gonna say because the alternative is worse.

Bill Gasiamis 4:41
I reckon busyness has put a lot of people in to an early grave. So what does busyness mean for you? Like what was that like? I have the same issue. When I first went through my two brain hemorrhages the first two. But most importantly, the first one, I ignored the numbness down my left side for seven days.

Bill Gasiamis 5:10
And it was because I was busy, I had work to do, I had a client to please, I needed to get paid. I needed to do all those things other than stop for five minutes and go and spend some time at a doctor and tell them what my symptoms were my wife tried to convince me to go my chiropractor tried to convince me to go, I argued with both of them. And when I eventually went, they said to me, we found a bleed in your brain. What was your busy schedule like? How many hours a day? What kind of work were you doing?

Deven Matthews 5:50
I’m a married man. Our marriage is fantastic we’ve been married 27 years, we have six kids say no more. So between working full time, and running six kids around, it was just crazy. busy times. And you know, I’ve certainly learned from the stroke to just slow down and don’t take life so seriously. I mean, like you there was a stress of earning a living and keeping the income coming in, and kids to soccer and piano lessons wherever they’re going and keeping up with them.

Deven Matthews 6:27
And so it was difficult. It’s fine. I don’t blame my family. I don’t blame anything. It’s completely my responsibility. And I have learned clearly. Did your kids ever hear no from you? I can’t take you to be in practice. I can’t take it soccer. You have to find your own way there. Did they ever hear no from you guys? No. And I have to give credit to my boss who she’s just as busy with the kids as I am.

Deven Matthews 6:57
And I don’t want to say they took up all of our time, because the good part of what I was doing is working as well. And so it just I don’t know, you got to make sure your priorities are in the right spot. And your health is definitely one of those priorities that needs to be near the top.

Bill Gasiamis 7:14
And it’s about balance. It’s also about being there for the kids doing the right thing for the family, supporting everyone. And then also keeping yourself the same privilege.

Deven Matthews 7:26
Right. Trying to stay sane the whole time.

Bill Gasiamis 7:31
What are the ages of the children? What do they range from?

Deven Matthews 7:35
At the time? My oldest was 23. My youngest was eight. So it’s just a big wide range, mostly adult children. So that doesn’t require as much care as the other ones. But the years leading up very, very busy, busy lifestyle.

Symptoms Of A Stroke And Seeking Medical Attention

Bill Gasiamis 7:56
On the day of the onset, what were some of the symptoms that you experienced? That you thought something was not right? Did you think something’s not right? I need to do something about this. How did you go about dealing with what was happening on the actual day?

Deven Matthews 8:15
Well, It was a Sunday morning, and I woke up and I woke up about nine you know, Sunday sleeping a little bit. And it just felt weird. I’ve heard your guests on this podcast that before, but something just felt off. Weird. Not really. See you’re shaking your head, you probably remember it just feels off. Something’s weird. And that probably. And I laid in bed for an hour and scrolled on the jawbone. You know I can do and then I decided okay, I’ll get up and get ready. So I got up and I just felt off balance. It felt like somebody was pushing my left side.

Deven Matthews 8:58
Over Sorry, I was like falling like walking on a moving train. The same type of feeling right. And I got up and went to the bathroom. And as I walked in the bathroom, I hit my shoulder against the doorframe I thought. What? How did I miss the doorframe, my whole life. I’ve never done that. And got in the shower. And in the shower, I reached for the bar suit with my right hand and I missed and I was like, What is going on? grayed out contrast. Everything was still weird, wonky.

Deven Matthews 9:37
And I went to the kitchen and I tried it. I thought oh, eat something. I appealed a banana. And I completely miss my mouth. I was taught that something is way off. Now this should have been enough science but the thing that finally pushed me over was it was a Sunday like I said, and I played the organ for my congregation at church, I played the piano since I was eight years old. I used to know I played one-handed.

Deven Matthews 10:07
And I went to my piano here to practice the songs for that service that day. And my right hand was missing all the notes. And like I said I’ve been playing since I was eight years old, and I knew something’s weird, something’s weird. And I go by symptoms, and it says, stroke.

Intro 10:27
If you’ve had a stroke, and you’re in recovery, you’ll know what a scary and confusing time it can be, you’re likely to have a lot of questions going through your mind, like, how long will it take to recover? Will I actually recover? What things should I avoid? In case I make matters worse, and doctors will explain things. But obviously, you’ve never had a stroke before, you probably don’t know what questions to ask.

Intro 10:51
If this is you, you may be missing out on doing things that could help speed up your recovery. If you’re finding yourself in that situation, stop worrying, and head to recoveryafterstroke.com where you can download a guide that will help you it’s called seven questions to ask your doctor about your stroke. These seven questions are the ones Bill wished he’d asked when he was recovering from a stroke, they’ll not only help you better understand your condition, they’ll help you take a more active role in your recovery. Head to the website. Now, recoverafterstroke.com and download the guide. It’s free.

Deven Matthews 11:29
sort of went to my wife who was getting ready for church in the bathroom and said, Hey, I think I’m having a stroke. And she looked at me and her face froze. And she said, Gavin, your right side is totally drooping. I said, Let’s go. Let’s go to the hospital is only like three minutes from my house. She jumped in the car. I gave the kids kiss goodbye just because I didn’t know what I was going to.

Deven Matthews 11:55
And I walked into the ER I was halfway across the parking lot with Rachel and the guy came out and said, what’s wrong with you? And I said, I think I’m having a stroke. He says stop, don’t move. He brought a wheelchair on for sure was liability reasons. He rolled the end and the doctors just went to town. Raise your arms. Okay. And you can’t follow my finger with your eyes, things like that. And they said get it back there. And sure enough, ischemic stroke.

Bill Gasiamis 12:24
Yeah. Were you a lot heavier at the time?

Deven Matthews 12:28
Yeah, yeah.

Bill Gasiamis 12:30
How much heavier?

Deven Matthews 12:32
I was over 300 pounds. I’ve lost 110 pounds since my stroke.

Bill Gasiamis 12:37
Okay, I have to convert that kilos. Because every episode most of my guests are overseas. So 300 pounds, to kilos. It’s 136 kilos that’s quite heavy. And you’ve lost 120 pounds. Yeah, 54 kilos. You know, that’s the size. The full grown adult 54 kilos, that’s another person.

Bill Gasiamis 13:20
So definitely, then, if somebody had seen you, without the droopiness, and all that kind of stuff, in a hospital setting, and you thought you felt unwell, they would have asked you the questions. Have you had your blood pressure checked? Have you got diabetes, that kind of stuff that would have definitely asked you those things? Because often those conditions come hand in hand with people who are heavy. So at that stage, given you the red carpet treatment. And then what happened?

Deven Matthews 14:01
They put me in a bed, put a TPA through me MRI, the whole nine yards. And the doctors kept saying, you know, they come in every 20 minutes or so and say raise both arms, because so they could see how the right was committed to a little action.

Deven Matthews 14:20
I could do pretty well. But slowly so over the hours the right arm was weaker and weaker and weaker until finally I couldn’t move it seemed to turn right ladybird asked me to move my foot up and down my left leg like side with my ankle, cross my leg and originally I couldn’t do it. So it was there completely paralyzed on the right side. And the ironic thing is, I didn’t know much about stroke clearly.

Deven Matthews 14:49
But I had heard things like people lose their cognitive ability to recall their memories. There. A lot of learning language things like that. I don’t want to lose my memory. I don’t want to lose memories for my kids when we’re sorry, our wives, what can I do? So while I was laying there in the bed, I was reviewing music theory in my head. I was saying things like, okay, the key of D has two sharps. The key of E flat major has for flatss, and I was going over music theory over and over and over, hoping I can hold on to it.

Deven Matthews 15:27
Luckily, I mean, I did I didn’t lose the data. It’s still real music. It’s so like I said, play the piano one handedly. But I do miss being able to play Boolean solvency. So I can say that scales, arpeggios that saved my cognitive might interpret lay me in the hospital bed. Also the location of the stroke wasn’t impacting that part of your brain. So that was good. And do you know where the blood clot kind of stopped where it landed? Which part of the brain?

Deven Matthews 16:03
I don’t and I tried to do some research for this podcast I just couldn’t find out in time.

Bill Gasiamis 16:10
That’s okay, so then you’ve spent some time in hospital how much time?

Deven Matthews 16:16
I was there five days. First night in the ER, two nights in ICU. And then what night and a regular room so I guess four nights. And then I was shipped out to a rehabilitation hospital, where I was for three weeks.

Bill Gasiamis 16:36
And in those three weeks, what did you have to overcome clearly your right hand, but what else kind of the right foot the need to survive? If you’re going to that person in the ER, even, I couldn’t sit up, I couldn’t rollover, I couldn’t really get comfortable. I couldn’t move anything I’m gonna read said. So the long haul back to be mobile, started in the rehab hospital. Because in the hospital hospital, there is no PT or OT, or speech therapy, even that uncertainty, I went to the

Deven Matthews 17:13
facility

Speaker 1 17:16
over that word rehab, but um, again, once I was in rehab, I was actually very happy because I had physical therapy, occupational therapy and speech therapy at least once a day, at least once, sometimes even twice. And you’re welcome to anybody that would come in and help me I welcomed it, because I’ve saw them as my key ticket to get back to normal, whatever normal, it’s, you know, so thick, man.

Reversing Type 2 Diabetes Through Diet And Exercise

Deven Matthews 17:44
I do like what, let’s do it. Let’s get up. Let’s move. It’s something I remember the first night, the first day, they had to put me on this machine to even stand me up. And it looks like some medieval torture device. But um, I hit the wrap my hands around the top, you lifted me up and I kind of stand out and I’m not so good because I was doing it on my own that had dementia learn how to do it without a machine.

Bill Gasiamis 18:09
With the right leg now how does that feel day to day?

Speaker 1 18:14
Now, decent my right leg is probably recovered. Again, it’s been two and a half, two years and three months. I’ve had we have about 80% of my leg back totally. My big hang ups the ankle ankle, my ankle just won’t budge a little bit, but not a lot.

Deven Matthews 18:32
Arm again I have about 60% rescind fingers are hard. That’s very rare. The piano doesn’t really happen on the hand. But I can move a lot with my arm just not as well as most.

Bill Gasiamis 18:49
When you were in hospital, did they then immediately diagnosed diabetes and high blood pressure?

Deven Matthews 18:55
Yes. And we have meds for it right away I’m still on meds for it. I’m happy to say a little bit. I got my emergency down to four. So they said you’re no longer considered a diabetic. So that’s good news. It took me out for the insulin. But the high blood pressure still on meds. And monitor it now much more often than you think you’re at home.

Bill Gasiamis 19:20
Type two diabetes is one of those conditions that people don’t realize how much they can reverse it how easy it is to reverse. Well, I know I said the word easy, but it can be reversed without medical intervention. Right? Correct. Yeah. How easy was it for you to lose the weight and reverse it?

Deven Matthews 19:43
That first month simple because I was in the hospital. They controlled everything I eat right? I was sent on my own to drive in McDonald’s to go to get ice cream. And when I got out of the hospital, I just stayed on that zero sugar diet.

Speaker 1 20:00
I mean, yes, eat fruit And if there’s sugar in like, a piece of bread, okay, but I do not eat any refined sugars, cookies, cakes, soda, I cut soda totally out of my diet. That was not easy, because that was frickin quite a bit of soda before. But again, like you said, I don’t like to use the word easy, but it’s not difficult to cut that stuff out of your life. After a week or two, we kind of lose the craving for it.

Deven Matthews 20:26
There’s obviously a curve, you know, but once you get over that hump, it’s kind of smooth sailing. Even now, today, I drink one soda a year on my birthday, I’ll go get a soda and enjoy it about I nursed that thing I make it lasts all day, and no soda at all. And so it’s things like that. I’m drinking a lot of water. It’s fine. Do I miss coke and Mountain Dew? Well, yes, but I know that turn it into three back in the hospital, the second shot, and they don’t want that.

Bill Gasiamis 20:59
I’m with you. I stopped drinking sodas. I’d say it was three or four months after my first two brain bleeds. And I and I used to drink Coke. And people when I’d visit people, my brother or whoever at their home, they knew false coming over that they should have cochlear because if they had Pepsi, or if they had another one, I’d be like, no I’ll just have a water.

Bill Gasiamis 21:24
And they didn’t want to disappoint me. So they would get me a Coke. And my thing was ice. So the glass needed to be full to the top of ice. And then you pour the coke over the top, which isn’t a lot of coke. Most of it stays in the can, right? And then you sip it through. And then you keep refilling the ice with coke. And then it’s always frosty, and cold and amazing.

Bill Gasiamis 21:55
Just fabulous. And then really bad for you at the same time without knowing it. So, yeah, so I stopped doing it. And then every once in a while, very, very rarely. I reckon in the last 12 years. I’ve been lucky if I’ve had five cans in total of soda. So on your birthday, you get a can of Coke or Mountain Dew. Which one do you prefer?

Deven Matthews 22:24
A Coke absolutely.

Bill Gasiamis 22:26
Yeah. The original recipe, right? Yes. Constantly. Yeah.

Bill Gasiamis 22:33
When is your birthday?

Deven Matthews 22:35
In March 26.

Coping With Diabetes And Stroke Stroke’s Emotional And Mental Challenges

Bill Gasiamis 22:37
March 26. You’ve just turned 50? Yes, I did. Okay, I’m turning 50 In a week from now. And I might celebrate it with I don’t know whether it’ll be with a coke. But it might be alcohol, I might have a drink of alcohol, which I very rarely have. So then you’ve gone through rehab, and then you’ve come home? What was it? Like coming home? How? How did you cope with the transition from hospital to home?

Deven Matthews 23:14
Obviously, huge, huge adjustment. I was in a wheelchair. And so I had to learn to navigate that. Luckily, thank goodness is we had a home where the master bedroom was downstairs, thank goodness. And we didn’t know when we bought the house, I was going to have a stroke. So that was a blessing. So I didn’t have to worry about stairs.

Deven Matthews 23:39
And I just had to learn to navigate the wheelchair around. It was hard because you lose all ability to do things like the dishes or laundry or a mass. And with that many kids have been in the house, even adult children. There’s a lot of dishes and laundry and medicine. And it was hard to just kind of let it go by it was also hard because I was always on asking my wife for help.

Deven Matthews 24:10
There’s laundry included you this and that. And can you help me take a shower? Can you help me get in bed? Can you help me and she’s got the liquid to worry about again. Luckily most of them were adults, but there was still the need when you have kids who don’t appear really stopping you. Right? So it was just a huge adjustment.

Deven Matthews 24:28
But um, and on top of that the thing I’ve heard your people your guests talk about before is the emotional the depression, the sadness, which is out of nowhere, you’re in tears and you’re crying and my wife is saying what’s wrong, Sean Sean and we’ve seen nothing really nothing really backed back up a little bit when I was in the hospital that first night the first night in the ER, after my referee poem and it was like two in the morning I was alone. I just burst into tears and I don’t know if it was fear of the unknown it was what’s going to happen. I was the benefit carrier for our family health insurance. And so I couldn’t just quit soccer game, you know?

Deven Matthews 25:14
All this unknown, how am I going to be a vegetable? I’m going to every conveyor belt loop again, am I going to be able to play piano again? Now it was albums, little things, and I just cried and cried and cried and a nurse walked in and just patted my hand and oh, it’s going to be okay. It’s going to be okay. And I bet no one’s not. But if myself now could tell myself then what it’s going to be like I would, I could explain that not as bad as you think it is. But once I was home, back to that, the emotional ups and downs and rollercoasters, it was hard to be a social, it was hard to be fun, it was hard to be laughy, it was hard to be teasing the kids. It was just very gray in heart. So now the physical but the mental side of everything.

Deven Matthews 26:03
Did you seek out someone to support you with that to help you with that? I talked to my primary care. And her answer was medicine. Well, numerous medicine will be fine. But here’s all the side effects. I’m gonna put my body through anything else, you know. So I decided to just self not self medicate, but self therapy, art therapy and dessert. I got books, I went online, I read a ton of information, including things you had written and posted your branding and things like that.

Deven Matthews 26:37
And people in your podcast and it just, I’ve learned that the emotional and mental depression that comes with the stroke in various levels is kind of a given. And so they can just work through it, it gets better. And clearly today, I’m not as bad as I was two years ago. And 900 Close. It’s really it seems like a two year mark, hey, went over a hump emotionally.

Deven Matthews 27:07
And it’s been so much better. But man, those first couple of years, it was tough feelings of despair and defeat. And, and what you’re doing is hard work, which adds to it, you know, and it was not easy but you get through it what other choice do you have?

Bill Gasiamis 27:27
Yeah, it’s not quite your mindset. Giving up on USA, it’s more your emotional state and perhaps having emotional experiences that you’ve never dealt with before. So you didn’t really have a catalogue of how to overcome it or resolve it. It sounds like your mindset was still pretty upbeat. But your your emotional state was the one that was taking a bit of a was challenged.

Deven Matthews 27:57
Yes, that’s absolutely right. Perfect.

Returning To Work After A Diabetes And Stroke Stroke

Bill Gasiamis 28:04
At the beginning, when we spoke, you mentioned that Sunday you were getting ready to go to church. How soon after you got back from home? Are you able to get back to church? Well, again, I didn’t want to accept the stroke as a change in my life. I knew it was I now would know it is but I was like, no, just keep going. So I took a couple of weeks off. And then I went to church in a wheelchair. I hadn’t arrived persuaded him wheelchair. And it was good to see people who’s good to be involved. In fact, in all aspects of my life, I try not to let the stroke impact too much what was going on.

Deven Matthews 28:45
Even in my work, when I had my stroke. I am I teach for a living, and a teacher the college actually. And the day after my stroke, I called my boss and I said, Hey, I had a stroke. Ooh, okay, we’ll cancel your classes get you substitutes. I said, No, no, no, no. I have two classes that need on campus once a week. Can I take those classes and just have them online for a few weeks?

Deven Matthews 29:18
And he was like, are you sure? And I said please. He said okay? And then I already had three classes online. So I had five classes all online. And that second night I called the nurse and I said, Can you put me into work shirt and I wrote a tape loop and I sat on my laptop and I taught my classes from the hospital. I didn’t do live lectures. I just would answer the questions and assignments and everything.

Deven Matthews 29:45
And the nurse was like what are you doing? I said working I have to make money someone’s going to pay for the hospital bill right? And she said, this is probably really good for your brain to just kind of keep going keep going into it. Who’s the in a way different than what you are. But I’ll tell you five weeks later, I was back in the classroom, I sent an email to my students. And I said, class, we’ll be back on campus this week. And again, I had my wife take me in the wheelchair, and I lectured from a wheelchair.

Deven Matthews 30:18
And my voice is not the same as it was before most stroke patients or survivors will say that. And so I was speaking slower. And the words were not as fluent as they were in the past, I had graduated speech therapy by then. But you can tell even now, there’s still a little bit of numbness in my mouth, that causes me to talk a little bit funny, but I didn’t let it stop me, I just kept working and working and working.

Deven Matthews 30:48
So once I was home, I still had my desk and everything I wrote, wrote our wheelchair up to never teach, do grades and everything else. And I just kept going in a hope that they would kind of normalize my, my life. And the part that was completely abnormal, would kind of learn a bit it can I think it has.

Bill Gasiamis 31:13
Good, often you’d hear strokes of others say they went back to work too soon. And then they realized that they needed to not do that, and then change things. And it’s good to try and go back as soon as you can. Because that is a sense of getting back to a routine a rhythm to being, you know, to being kind of close to your old identity, and all those types of things, it is good.

Bill Gasiamis 31:38
And, whether you’re up for it or not. Your brain’s gonna be the judge of that, and it’s going to give you the feedback, and it’s gonna say, you went back to work too early, my friend, you need to go home and do nothing. Or, this is good for us. We’re loving it. And it is good. And I love the fact that you did that.

Bill Gasiamis 32:02
I was working from my hospital bed as well, sending emails and making phone calls more than anything. The first time. I was in there for about a week. I wasn’t doing too much, but I was doing enough to kind of keep the business ticking. Because without me there, you know, there’s a business and without the businesses they money.

Bill Gasiamis 32:21
Same reason, right. And then we and then I realized the second time after the second blade, things got worse, and I wasn’t able to work, it was actually counter productive to be at work because it would wipe me out. And I wouldn’t be productive and doing the right things anyway. And it was too risky for me to be at work for several months until things started to improve again.

Bill Gasiamis 32:52
And then I went back to work as quickly as I could, once again, I mean, if we’re not working, even if our pursuits are not our passion, even if our sheets are not you know, the most noble or whatever they are, it’s still great to be able to get up and go somewhere, even if it’s not work for money, even if it’s just volunteering.

Bill Gasiamis 33:17
And I did a lot when I couldn’t work for money. I was volunteering for the Stroke Foundation, I’d go and do presentations on stroke prevention and awareness and know the signs of stroke. And that was that gave you a sense of purpose something to put your shoes on for to get ready for to plan for. And a lot of the times I failed that that as well, I failed because I forgot about a presentation that I needed to do. And then I would get the phone call.

Bill Gasiamis 33:51
Are you on your way to the presentation? What presentation? And then I’d look at my diary. And then I noticed the calendar reminded me yesterday, or reminded me this morning. And still, all of those things weren’t enough to get me there. So like, it’s still good to have something to aim towards to overcome all of this stuff, even if it’s not work. And even if you’re in a bad way, even if you’re really unwell.

Bill Gasiamis 34:23
Whatever it is that you can do it because it kind of uplifts uplifts the soul, allows you to focus on something else gives you a little bit of sense of purpose and a little bit of meaning. And as hard as it is you still got to try and then reassess once you’re in that situation and then make a decision as to whether you’re going to keep going down that path or not. But I think like I think it’s like a bit of a muscle you know, the more you train the brain to get to work and overcome the challenges and be gentle to it and kind to it, the more that you’re helping it rehabilitate, and you’re helping it get better.

Bill Gasiamis 35:06
So how busy are you now? At work at home? Is it the same amount of busyness? Or have you found a way to be a little less busy and more kind of conscious of how much time and effort you’re putting into other things?

Sustainable Busy-ness After A Diabetes And Stroke Recovery

Deven Matthews 35:27
It’s obviously the latter. I mean, it’s I make sure I don’t miss myself and I take time to just make sure I’m taking care of myself and taking care of things that need to be done. Yes, I’m still working, and I love it. But I’d obviously my day is spent more on with my physical well being, well, well, mindedness, if that’s the word, I exercise, I go for walks every single day. In fact, when I was about a month after I was in the rehab rehabilitation hospital, I went by went to a stroke support group, and met a woman who had been error away from her stroke for about two years.

Deven Matthews 36:12
And she said, let me give you some advice, when you run out your insurance stops paying for physical therapy, go out and hire yourself a personal trainer, she said, I’ve done it. And it’s been the best thing ever. And so I’ve done that. And I spend most of my days now, if I’m not with the trainer, exercising myself here at home, but if they’re just going out for a walk, where I walk around my kitchen island, dude, me little Lego hips.

Deven Matthews 36:42
I lay in my bed, do my arm lifts, and I broke my cord. So I spend my time now working out and I bought my physical body so that I can maintain my recovery as well as my health. And so I would say, I’m just as busy to answer your question, Bill, but it’s just doing different things. I’m not so much crazy busy trying to boost my career to this or do that. But I’m just trying to fill my time with other things that are meaningful.

Bill Gasiamis 37:13
Yeah, that makes sense. That’s good. Because there is crazy busy, they’re busy probably the one that’s not useful. Maybe not helpful all the time. But it’s necessary to be crazy busy sometimes. But I think, ongoing, it’s been unsustainable. That is what we’ve seemed to learn. That’s what I’ve learned about that is that it’s unsustainable, and it doesn’t lead to a good outcome, it can often lead to a negative outcome where we ignore the symptoms of stroke and keep going.

Bill Gasiamis 37:53
That’s not good. That’s crazy busy. And then I’m very busy now as well, because I record my podcasts on a Saturday on a Sunday, and sometimes a Friday. Which means that that takes a lot of my time. But it’s pleasurable. It’s fun, you know, I meet people from all around the world, we share common thoughts, values, ideas, struggles, and it’s a completely different version of busy and it gives me back energizes me instead of drains me and makes me tired and makes me unwell.

Deven Matthews 38:26
So let me ask you something. Would you rather be working on your podcast or working on your book? How was that

Bill Gasiamis 38:36
The book is a terrible thing. It’s a terrible thing. I’ll tell you why. Because you have creative blocks. And I would consider myself a creative, but I never went down the path of creating something like a music track, or a novel or anything like that. I never did any of those things, even though it was obviously in me. And the problem that the book caused was, when I wasn’t writing, I was always thinking about the fact that I wasn’t writing.

Bill Gasiamis 39:10
And when I was writing, and couldn’t write, I was frustrated because I really desperately wanted to write, but I couldn’t write. It’s such a cruel, cruel thing to do to somebody. And, as a result of that, by drag that out for two years, the writing part of it I dragged out for two years. The research part was two years, but that was more enjoyable, more pleasurable.

Bill Gasiamis 39:39
And that was more about trying to find the pattern, trying to understand things, to make the idea that stroke was the best thing that happened to me like interesting and to make it something that people would be curious about, interested to read, to not be confronted by the fact that I said that about a stroke.

Bill Gasiamis 40:04
So that part was a really cool part because there was nothing to do other than think about it. It was all just, you know, listen to somebody’s story, think about it, develop the idea, and then just sit with it, let it just bubble away. But then it was putting pen to paper.

Bill Gasiamis 40:22
And what happened is, of course, is, then I go through all those other things like, like being conscious of the fact that I am not a literary type. I don’t write for a living, I don’t know how to write properly. Is this going to be good enough? Who am I to write a book? Why would I write a book? Who’s going to want to read my book? When they do? It’s probably going to be terrible anyway.

Bill Gasiamis 40:49
I went through all of that stuff. So I wouldn’t change it for anything. I would I love occupying my time writing the book. But it’s more fun. Interviewing people having podcasts because there’s nothing to do afterwards. It’s just to edit it and make it live. It just gives back. That’s it. There’s no it’s not hard. It’s not difficult for me to overcome. That’s interesting.

Deven Matthews 41:22
We’ll you’re doing amazing. That’s, that’s absolutely true.

Bill Gasiamis 41:25
Yeah, thank you. I think it is amazing. I mean, the guy that I was before, stroke doesn’t do any of these things. Like I am very aware that I am not the same person, I am out of like I’m an evolved version of myself. I’m completely aware of it. And I’m not trying to say that I’m perfect. In every way. I’m not, I’m just doing things that I love that are different.

Bill Gasiamis 41:52
I would have spent many Saturdays working. And I won’t spend a Saturday working for the rest of my life, if I can manage it like I’m dead against it. It means that you miss out on a little bit of extra money, and all that type of thing, but it’s okay. I’ve done enough work. And I do enough hours Monday to Friday where I think I would be grumpy if I had to go to work six days a week, every week, you know, and I’d be the same guy I was that I didn’t like before the stroke. You know, what’s the point of that? I didn’t want to be that guy.

Deven Matthews 42:35
Right.

Bill Gasiamis 42:38
So what’s it like? When the kids kind of work out that you’re unwell and the young one, eight years old, probably a difficult conversation. 23 year old, probably different for another reason. How do you navigate all those conversations with the kids and so many different personalities?

Deven Matthews 43:01
Again, I had to give most of the credit to my wife, she’s amazing. She’s just an amazing woman. But yeah, the older kids were scared. The younger ones are scared for different reasons. And now they’re really adjusted, my physical therapist asked me how, like on my third bracelet with them, she said, How would your youngest one dealing with you having a stroke?

Deven Matthews 43:30
Matt said, I think he’s I mean, he’s eight, he just kind of accepts it either. So he’s afraid Daddy may die that he knows, I’ll die someday, you know. But um, he said in his experience as a physical therapist, when the stroke survivor has young kids looks, those kids gained a keen awareness of disabilities, and differences in people and acceptance. And that was like a best. It’s something I never ever would have thought of before.

Disability And Faith

Deven Matthews 44:03
And so now I try and watch my younger because I have now he’s 10 the second one. The second thing is is 15 I watch them and they’re just so they know I take a little extra time to get in the car. But no, I think he’s trying to you know, get out of the house or take a shower or whatever. But they’re just fine with it because it’s part of their life. And so hopefully that will extend it outside of the artist immediate circle.

Deven Matthews 44:32
Not other children wouldn’t feel that way. But with my younger two who are still at home in figuring out what to do to those who are at home now. They’re much more accepting of the disabled person. I think not many others aren’t but they exist. They’ve never done this yet, but it’s more about commonplace thing.

Bill Gasiamis 44:53
The less ignorant.

Deven Matthews 44:55
There we go. That’s perfect. Yes.

Bill Gasiamis 44:57
And we were more ignorant, and not through our fault, our own fault, like, it’s just the way it was, you never came across it and you didn’t know. And then I had to be in a wheelchair for an amount of time. And then I realized what life’s like being in a wheelchair. And even though it was a short amount of time, it gave me a very deep understanding of the difficulties that people face on a daily basis. And the need and my needs increased, you know, had more needs more, needs to have other people support me, help me, etc.

Bill Gasiamis 45:34
And I have often said this in the podcast, but it always sounds terrible when I say but I always just thought people in wheelchairs were just sitting down. You don’t connect the reason that they’re sitting down to anything, because I’ve never had that experience. So I never understood the emotional difficulties with being in a wheelchair, the mental difficulties with being in a wheelchair, the physical disabilities with being in a wheelchair, or the challenges that somebody in a wheelchair has to overcome, like, when somebody is able bodied. Everyone complains about our how hard things are, and all the challenges and all the problems and all the things.

Bill Gasiamis 46:23
And then somebody who’s in a wheelchair is already, you know, recovering from potentially a stroke or something like that. So they’ve got a lot to deal with because of the stroke. And now they have all this physical stuff that they’ve got to overcome. So not only have they been given this neurological condition, now they’ve got overcome with a neurological condition or the physical aspects of the challenge, right? So it’s like, completely out of balance, the amount of challenges that somebody

Bill Gasiamis 46:55
you know, with a with a stroke, who’s in a wheelchair has to overcome is so out of balance compared to people who are not in there. And it’s like, okay, now you can be Bill, you can be a little more empathetic, a little more patient a little more understanding, and lived experience makes the world of difference. And that’s kind of what your youngest have got. They’ve got a very amazing lesson, something that’s going to really make a positive impact to the way they navigate the world. It’s important.

Deven Matthews 47:36
Exactly.

Bill Gasiamis 47:44
How good would it be to learn all those lessons without somebody you love going through stroke, but sometimes it’s the only way to learn.

Deven Matthews 47:52
Right? Absolutely.

Bill Gasiamis 47:55
So remember those early days when you had the depressive symptoms and all those other challenges? How your self healing? Did you draw on your religious views, beliefs to help guide you with overcoming those challenges? How did the role that your church played in your life support in that space?

Speaker 1 48:28
Well, absolutely a huge, a huge portion. I mean, every day, a basic Christian belief in Jesus, the resurrection, the atonement, things that kept me moving, the promise of a Sunday, perfect body. Those beliefs really helped me move along. And regardless of what I’m facing in this life, as far as disabilities are inabilities is when they will be taken from me.

Speaker 1 49:00
On top of that, on top of the basic religious belief that is in my core, or the, the mental thoughts of a better existence now, okay, I can’t change that I had a stroke. I can’t change the verb awkward. The lender I talked about New York, I can’t put the piano. What can I do? Years ago, I used to listen to talk radio before podcasts before the internet, you know, and there is this silent psychiatrist psychologist who would tell a story that you might have heard before I might have heard even on the show about a boy who goes to his grandfather and his grandfather says, you know, son, how is your life? How is your relationship with your friends, your parents, how are you doing? Like, being good, the bad how how’s that going on?

Feeding The “Recovery Tiger” vs. The “Self-Pity Tiger”

Deven Matthews 49:55
And the boy looks with grandpa and said, it’s hard. I want to make good boy, a good Christian, if you will. But there’s another part of me that wants to be kind of bad. And sometimes I want to do the right thing and tell the truth and do both like grade school to admit, sometimes I’m lazy and wonder why this and that, and the little boy, he was just so you know, exasperated, he said, it’s like, there’s two tigers inside of me, and they’re fighting. And the good Tiger wins within some of the bad Tiger winds.

Deven Matthews 50:26
And he looked at his grandfather, and he said, Grandpa, which one is going to win. And the grandfather in his wisdom said, the tiger that wins is a tiger that you feed, whichever one you feed is going to win. And I love that story. It can be applied to so many things. And so once I had the stroke, and I was just thinking or meditating, the thought came in my head, I thought, okay, there’s two tigers inside of me right now, the recovery tiger that wants to get up and walk and not be in pain and just get over this thing.

Deven Matthews 51:00
And, then there is the self pity Tiger. And the one must lay in bed and cry and know, for me why this happened to me. And those are the two tigers that I think still today, two years, three months out, I’m still fighting. I think everybody fights those two tigers, it’s some way in their life, I’m just leaving it to stroke. So for your stroke survivors sort of listen or listening to this.

Deven Matthews 51:25
Think about that is a recovery, Tiger winning, or is your self pity, Tiger winning, because the one that’s gonna win is the one you feed. And so with my faith in God, and my religious beliefs, I can take that level the tigers, and fight knowing that what I do is going to make a difference in my recovery and in my mindset, and then I ability to move on with life. And yeah, there’s still sad days.

Deven Matthews 51:55
Yeah, there’s still sub periods. Yeah, there’s still as a thought, Why did I have a stroke? You know what, those other fat guys out there, they don’t have strokes and things like that. But in the end, how I see my Tigers is how I’m going to win. So when I get up, and I go for a walk, and I worked out for a half hour, and then I worked on the computer for school or read article, whatever it is, I’m fighting, I’m feeding the recovery Tiger. And that, I think, is the message that every stroke recovery person should consider feed the Tiger can recover, not the other one.

Bill Gasiamis 52:34
I love that. And the easy way to do that is the more time you spend feeding the recovery Tiger, reading a book listening to a podcast, understanding how to overcome your challenges, you know, rehabilitating yourself physically, emotionally, mentally, then there’s no space for the other Tiger. There just isn’t. And then the other one just kind of whittles away. And every once in a while it kind of tries to pop up and say hello. And it’s like, I heard what you had to say, I’m not interested in the rest of the conversation.

Deven Matthews 53:13
Exactly, exactly. I like what you said about educating yourself listening to podcasts, your podcasts when I listen to Iraq’s but even joining support groups. I have an online stroke support group that we meet every single week. And it’s just sometimes I go and I don’t say anything, I just kind of listen, sometimes I chime in, but it just gives you hope.

Deven Matthews 53:38
That there’s people out there that are going through a year going through and they can understand you. I have a very dear friend who is a he goes through he is a recovering alcoholic and drug addict and he attends Alcoholics Anonymous wins. And he compared his recovery to mine recovery. And he said I had an addiction. I had major problems. I had things I couldn’t overcome. Just like Deven, you have things you’re trying to overcome and you can’t, but you meet with these people who also have the same exact, I’ll say problems.

Deven Matthews 54:15
I don’t like that word, but the same exact situation that you have, just like he goes meet some of these people that have the same problems. He has again at Adisa word. And he says there’s just a great spirit of unity, where you can look at these people and say, okay, they did it, I can do it. Under they can do it that type of thing. And that beads that tiger again, like you said, pretty common.

Bill Gasiamis 54:40
Yeah, it’s community. There’s no point hanging around with the people who are not for recovery or not supporting recovery or not chasing recovery or not going after recovery. Because, you know, that’s they’re going to encourage you to go down that path of feeding the other tiger in the book, there’s a chapter about creating your right community building the right community, I call it a recovery community. And when I was researching that chapter, I found a book that was called connected.

Bill Gasiamis 55:15
And the book had amazing research done by two scientists. And we’re going to, I want to lower the book and I want to make sure that anyone who’s listening might be able to find that if they want connected the book, I’m just Googling it okay, is called Connected. And it was by two amazing scientists, I think there were psychologists or in that space. One of them is called Nicholas Christakis. And the other one is called James Fowler.

Bill Gasiamis 56:01
And what they discovered is that there’s this saying, you may have heard, you hear a lot in the personal development world, you’re the average of the five people that you are, spend the most time with. And it’s, it’s only part of the picture, what they have found is that you’re also the average of the five people that those five people spend the most time with. And then it goes one layer back, that those five people spend the most time with. So by the time you spend one week with the five people you spend the most of the time with, you’re actually being influenced by about 125 people.

Bill Gasiamis 56:52
And that’s really important to know, because if you’re a diabetic, who also has high blood pressure, and you continue to hang out, in places where people eat too much McDonald’s or drink too many sodas, and you’re trying to break the habit, it’s a lot harder to break the habit, because the community that you hang out with, could be amazing people could be fantastic company, but could be also making it a lot harder for you to break those habits. And then, with regards to the other parts of recovery, it’s the same thing.

Bill Gasiamis 57:33
If you’re hanging around people who are downers all the time, who are negative, who focus on problems, who complain who when to moan, then you’re more likely to be influenced in that way. And what they say is, you don’t need to cut people off and just forget they ever existed, what you need to do is just move, move your time, the time you allocate to another community where it’s more uplifting, supportive, encouraging, where they understand you where they’ve been through what you’ve been through, where they can shine the light.

Bill Gasiamis 58:08
And that’s what a support group does, right? That’s exactly what the stroke support group does. A group you never knew of you never hung out with you never attended, all you’ve done is shift a few hours a week, and you’ve just allocated into there, all of a sudden, now you’re speaking with one person, and that one person is influenced by a whole bunch of other people above them.

Bill Gasiamis 58:33
And they’re potentially all going through something similar or recovering. And you’re getting, you’re getting a quicker path to recovery, because now you’re being influenced by the people who are supportive of a recovery, so you can very easily shift the balance without a lot of energy toward recovery, just by changing the small component of time that you spend in this new space instead of the old space.

Bill Gasiamis 59:09
And churches are great for that, stroke forums, online communities are good for that. What I love about the church is faith, regardless of whether or not you’re very religious, whether you believe in Jesus, whether you believe in God and any of those things.

Bill Gasiamis 59:27
That word faith, I think, is a really important word. Because if you learn faith in a religious setting, to break it down just for the sake of conversation. Very basically what we’re being told is to believe in something that happened 2000 years ago, or the good of humanity, and also to believe in something that we can’t see God.

Bill Gasiamis 59:51
And there’s a whole bunch of learning and lessons that come with that, that if you do this, then you get that result. If you do that, you’ll get that result and it’s kind of like guiding light for how to get great outcomes in life. And I think without religion, I’m not sure if faith can be practiced so deeply, if you can practice faith without that foundational part of faith that religion kind of requests of you or asks of you or makes you go to.

Bill Gasiamis 1:00:24
And if you could take faith and develop your faith in your recovery, even if you can’t see it in the future, even if you don’t believe that will happen, even if you don’t know what the future holds, but you have faith that it could happen, and that it’s worth going after, then you might manifest it, like it might occur. It’s a good thing to put your faith in a potential, your own self, to be able to overcome all the challenges and be the kind of person that you want them to be, even if it’s hard, if you’ve never believed in yourself before might be a good time to start practicing faith.

Speaker 1 1:01:07
Right. And I think even little acts, along with the science, like doing what your physical therapist tells you is paid, because you don’t know the result, you can’t see that this is going to happen because this, you just trust Him. They had faith in her and they do what they say, you know, I was at physical therapy once. And my therapist was helping me on notice something. And there was another guy in the room working with his therapist, and he just shouted at her. I can’t stand up, you don’t know what it’s like you never had a stroke was like battling against her.

Deven Matthews 1:01:43
And I couldn’t understand that mindset. I was like, Dude, she is trying to help you do what she says. So, again, I don’t know if it was my faith that I have before the stroke, or what if a doctor tell me to do something, I get it because I thought, okay, they do this for a living, when school for this, they work with these people, they know if I do X, Y will be the result. And so I’m gonna do it. And so I still do that. I mean, I’m not fully recovering that hopefully one day, but I’m still doing X, Y, Z, because I hope that the results are what they want.

Bill Gasiamis 1:02:18
I love what you said about that it is it’s faith in other people. And it just reminded me of something that we do have, we do practice faith all the time, every time you jump in the car and go for a drive, you have faith that the other person is going to stay on this side of the white line.

Bill Gasiamis 1:02:40
And they’re going to stop at the red light. And they’re gonna give way when they need to give way. And I have to say that in my time of driving, I’m gifted this year, a very high percentage, and more than 99.999% of the time people have done exactly what I had faith in them that they would do, which is stay in the right side of the road and break when they needed to and stop at the stop sign and give me way.

The Hardest Thing About Diabetes And Stroke For Deven Matthews

Bill Gasiamis 1:03:12
So it is a fascinating thing we do practice it more often than we think. And when you get on public transport, you have faith that it’ll turn up that it’s going to take you to your destination. Okay. So there you go that’s a great way to think about it. I’m wondering, Devin, what was one of the hardest things about stroke for you?

Deven Matthews 1:03:37
Hardest? Losing my ability to play the piano for sure. I still will cry about that I will go to church now and hear the organ playing and just weep because I used to be able to do that. And I loved it. I mean, it was my passion. I loved playing the piano and playing the organ and I haven’t lost it. I still do it. But it’s just not quite the same one handed. There’s plenty of concertos and pieces out there for one handed piano, but it’s not the same. So by far, there’s been losing that ability.

Deven Matthews 1:04:15
Again, I just keep plowing because I can’t change that and I don’t want to sit in dark room and cry because that won’t solve anything. But I can do my exercises or fingers or my hands and maybe someday looking back. I’m hoping I see other stroke survivors were further ahead than I am to have full use of the hands and there’s even some things we’re looking into to assist medically and technologically and stuff like that. And I’m we’re doing all I can’t I want to do everything I can to get it back.

Bill Gasiamis 1:04:52
Yeah, I love the medical assistance is important to go after if you can manage it. We recently did an interview about That eternacept injection that is been widely discussed, especially for people living in the United States, which is a medication that gets used for reducing inflammation in people with rheumatoid arthritis. And what they found was that it improves some neurological conditions for some people, not for everybody.

Bill Gasiamis 1:05:23
And I did an episode probably about five or six episodes ago, where I interviewed somebody who flew from New Zealand to Florida to chat with Dr. Tobinick, to have the injection and had a positive result went from not being able to work to being able to work and teach again. And then there’s also some people that have had the injection and it hasn’t worked for.

Bill Gasiamis 1:05:48
But then I also interviewed a gentleman, Dr. Amir Hadanny, who does scientific research hyperbaric oxygen therapy, and some of the positive results that they received with that. Now, none of these procedures are cheap, none of them are cheap, but they’re worth knowing about what people in future in case, people who can’t manage it, fondant now might be able to manage it in the future.

Bill Gasiamis 1:06:19
So that’s really good. And then there’s also those robotic devices that you can invest in to put on your hand to help train it to open and close and develop new neural pathways and see if that can help. Are you able to talk about any of the things that you’re considering or thinking about?

Deven Matthews: FDA-Approved Neurostimulation Device For Stroke Recovery

Deven Matthews 1:06:44
Yes, well, I have a Bioness. For my leg, it shoots out electronic, maybe you’re familiar with Bioness. I have a stamp machine I use on my hands that same bundle using a machine. But I don’t know if you’ve heard much about Vivistim it is a device input, the inserts, I guess, better word are back on your collarbone, the opposite side of your affected side. And it connects to a nerve in your brain that operates your arm.

Deven Matthews 1:07:40
And then from what I read, there is very milk and remote control that a therapist uses to stimulate the arm and make it work. And the results are amazing. YouTube has tons of videos before and after. And so on going down to LA next month for a consultation to see if I can get that done that fight with my insurance company will then listen and pursue that to see who pays for it. But we’re going to look into that to see if it’s something that’s worth it.

Bill Gasiamis 1:08:19
That’s a great idea. What’s the procedure called?

Deven Matthews 1:08:22
I don’t know the procedure, but the name of the thing is Vivistim. The FDA has approved it. And they’ve had remarkable success with people who have seizures, or epilepsy and other reasons, other reasons for seizures, but they started applying it to stroke survivors. And again, success.

Bill Gasiamis 1:09:01
So here it is, it is a Vivistim is the first FDA approved neurostimulation device to pair VNS with your rehabilitation therapy and daily activities. The pairing helps strengthen the brain connections needed to improve hand and arm function. It’s the only system of its kind and it is proven safe and effective.

Bill Gasiamis 1:09:26
Okay, so that doesn’t tell me much, but I understand what it does. It’s one of those stimulation devices like you what’s similar in a way to the Bioness. That’s what the Bioness does, but for the leg. So yeah, excellent. Well, I think people will be interested to hear about that. So maybe they’ll get curious and start Googling it as well.

Lessons From The Diabetes And Stroke Stroke

Bill Gasiamis 1:09:59
What’s something that stroke has taught you?

Deven Matthews 1:10:06
I saw on your Instagram page, I saw this and I commented on it is that don’t believe your doctors. I’m telling you two things happened that were just devastated in the ER. The first was the doctor came in and said, Okay, you’ve had a stroke, you have six months, wherever you’re at six months, that’s where you’ll be the rest of your life. And it scared me to death.

Deven Matthews 1:10:31
Again, no experience with stroke, no family with stroke, nothing. So I didn’t know. So that was my first strike. Second was my brother came and saw me in the hospital. And he said, Hey, Devin, we know this lady, and she had a stroke. And four months later, she was back to normal, perfect. And that was take four months, okay into this for four months, and four months came environment, and then six months, and it’s false hopes.

Deven Matthews 1:10:59
And so the doctor that said, six months. And then on the opposite end of the scale, my brother that I said four months, we’re both very difficult lessons. For me. The lesson is, each stroke survivor has his own recovery, there’s no rubber stamp, there’s no normal, it’s all individual, because the brain is so individualized. And the damage that’s done, whether from a hemorrhagic or from ischemic is so individualized, so my own brain is recovering on my own time. And that six month garbage? No, I don’t know why doctor saying that. I don’t know why.

Bill Gasiamis 1:11:43
Yeah, I don’t know why either. Your brother was trying to do the right thing as well, wasn’t he? He was trying to encourage you and tell you.

Deven Matthews 1:11:53
Yes. He wasn’t being mean or anything. And history’s true stroke four months. She was fine. Great. Good for her.

Bill Gasiamis 1:12:04
Yep. What would you say to stroke survivors who are listening that might be going through their own struggles at the moment.

Deven Matthews 1:12:14
Again, don’t feed the pity party Tiger, feed their strong Tiger, be the tiger you want to win? Thank goodness, in my stroke support group. It’s on Zoom. So let’s see just the basis of all this people from all over the world actually. And some people are, they just look sad, because look, defeated, that look like they’re not going to win every comment or their mouth is negative. And I know it’s easy to feel that way. I know you’ve had a brain bleed, you now have a stroke in your mind just slips into that depression sometimes.

Deven Matthews 1:12:51
But my goodness, you got to keep positive and you’ve got to keep going. If my if I could go back to myself two years ago, what would I say to him, I’d say just play it, it gets better. It gets better, it gets better. And it doesn’t seem like it’s going to so that started to take any stroke survivor. At the rehab hospital, I actually was in for three weeks. They have a program where stroke survivors go and visit patients in the hospital that have had a stroke. And I’m in the process of signing up to do that and get it all the releases and everything. But that’s going to be my message is just wait it you two years from now can talk to you. They’ll tell you just hold on. If it gets better, it gets better.

Bill Gasiamis 1:13:41
Devon, thank you so much for reaching out to be on the podcast. Thank you for your comments on my Instagram page. I really appreciate you sharing your story. Best of luck with everything.

Deven Matthews 1:13:52
Thank you. Thank you and to you your book, everything, congratulations. This has been a pleasure. I enjoyed it.

Bill Gasiamis 1:13:58
Well thanks again for joining us on today’s episode, I do hope you picked up some useful bits of information from my chat with Deven. If you’re interested in my book about stroke recovery, you can grab a copy on Amazon by visiting recoveryafterstroke.com/book. To learn more about my guests including links to their social media and to download the full interview transcript head over to recoveryafterstroke.com/episodes.

Bill Gasiamis 1:14:26
A huge thank you to everyone who has left a review it means the world to me. Reviews are crucial for podcasts to thrive and your feedback helps others find this valuable content making their stroke recovery journey a little easier. If you haven’t left a review, please consider leaving a five star rating and a few words about what the show means to you on iTunes or Spotify. If you’re watching on YouTube, leave a comment below, like the episode and subscribe to the show on your preferred platform to get notifications of future.

Bill Gasiamis 1:14:59
Besides, if you are a stroke survivor with a story to share, come and join me on the show. The interviews are not scripted, you do not have to plan for them. Just be yourself and share your experience to help others in similar situations. If you have a commercial product that supports stroke survivors in their recovery, you can join me on a sponsored episode of the show. Just visit recoveryafterstroke.com/contact fill out the form and I’ll get back to you with details about how we can connect via zoom. Thank you once again for being here. Listening participating. I truly appreciate you see you on the next episode.

Intro 1:15:39
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