Why Your Org Chart Isn't the Enemy / Ellen Pittman / Ep. #233

Service Design Show

What if we’ve been led down the wrong path…

When it comes to service design, we’re often told the main goal is to break down silos. And that makes sense, right?

Our organizations are structured vertically, but the experiences we design flow horizontally. This clash creates friction, so the natural instinct is to declare war on silos.

But what if that’s sending us in the wrong direction?

Silos exist for a reason; they bring focus and efficiency to specific tasks. The real problem is often the broken connection between them. So, what if instead of trying to eliminate silos, we focused on repairing them?

In this episode, I talk with Ellen Pittman, a researcher who shares a fascinating case study from a high-stakes organization struggling to meet a critical, time-sensitive performance target. On the surface, the pressure was on a single department to solve it.

But as they dug deeper, they discovered the true bottleneck wasn't in that department at all, or even on the organizational chart. The real roadblocks were less visible and far more human.

So what does it take to overcome these hidden barriers?

Ellen found a specific mix of ingredients that allowed them to collaborate across team boundaries and address the issue with great success.

In our conversation, we explore what those ingredients are and why it seems so hard for most organizations to get them right.

This episode has the potential to reframe your thoughts on silos, leadership, and the roadblocks you think are in your way.

A theme that I really loved exploring was how easily organizational metrics can be "gamed". We've all seen it, you hit the target but miss the actual goal... we talk about antidote in the episode.

Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact.

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to Episode 233

05:00 Vertical vs. Horizontal Structures

06:00 Ellen's Journey into Healthcare Change

07:30 Hospital Case Study

10:30 Real Challenge: System-Wide Impact

12:30 Breaking Silos: A Hospital's Approach

15:30 Leadership Beyond KPIs: True Purpose

23:30 Top-Down Initative, Bottom-Up Ownership

25:30 The Consultant's Fear of ED Patients

27:45 Overcoming Fear with Data Experiments

30:00 Data as Curiosity, Not Blame

35:30The CEO's Risky Vulnerability

39:30 Leadership Flexibility: When to Take Control

44:30 Repairing Silos vs. Breaking Them

45:30 Overcoming Jadedness

48:30 Reconnecting to Shared Purpose

52:30 Principles Etched in Minds, Not Walls

55:30 Why Cultural Change Takes Time

59:00 Insulating Change at Every Level

1:01:00 Leaders & The System: Mutual Understanding

1:04:00 Alan's Book: The Hive Model of Fluidity

1:07:45 Question to Ponder

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr-ellen-pittman-27311421a/

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

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--- [4. FIND THE SHOW ON] ---

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